Curse

glacialphoenix · Aug 09, 2008, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

It's overpowered for PuGs. It is pretty much an absolute safety net against failure. I don't care either way - I don't even play anymore - but those of you claiming that this is a balanced skill seriously need to get a clue.

I never said it was balanced - but now I'm wondering if they're trying to encourage PUGging again with this as an elite. It's probably going to get the nerfbat soon, though.

amibrunner · Aug 09, 2008, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by glacialphoenix

I never said it was balanced - but now I'm wondering if they're trying to encourage PUGging again with this as an elite. It's probably going to get the nerfbat soon, though.

The skill still sucks for any non-PUG group.

glacialphoenix · Aug 09, 2008, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by amibrunner

The skill still sucks for any non-PUG group.

I'm not disagreeing. In fact I said this earlier:

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I wouldn't take this if I was playing with my guildies, because I know they won't leave me in a situation where UA becomes handy.

JoeKnowMo · Aug 09, 2008, 05:55 PM // 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

For N/Mo shens, UA+DN should be sufficient in most cases. We're looking at 8*105 = 840 armor-ignoring damage with 8 players.

As a damage option, UA+DN is pretty weak. CoP, Necrosis, an MM with DN, Visions of Regret, SS, a nuker, etc. will put out as much or more sustained damage and they won't waste time running in as well as the time being rezzed (takes 2-3s before a rez happens). You'll rack up the DP pretty fast which means a HM run will come to an end.

UA is broken when it comes to split teams and possibly a player running to the end of a mission and rezzing the team from there, although I can't think of an entire mission that could be skipped in this fashion, there are parts of missions where it could be useful.

And yes, it's broken for pugs. But pugs are broken (in a bad way) in the first place. Finally I don't have to gimp my bar because the pug believes I should bring a rez. Nor do I have to use rez scrolls when someone dies because I refuse to gimp my bar.

UA is less energy efficient than HBoon due to the 1e pip loss and the lack of a Heal Party spam which means probably more deaths. Factor in the ursan nerf which makes protting more valuable and pugs are going to be dying more as well.

If people find ways to really exploit this skill, I'd like to see a nerf (compass range rez maybe). Other than that it's nice to have a skill that makes pugging tolerable.

Edit: Anyone notice UA rezzing someone other than the top dead player in the party list? Or does it go random sometimes?

BruskoKariskoff · Aug 09, 2008, 09:10 PM // 21:10

Wiki says it seems to normally res the first dead person in the party menu, but not always......but that's wiki...

lol

-Lotus- · Aug 09, 2008, 09:34 PM // 21:34

anyone tried this on heroes yet? do they maintain it or end it at all on their own?

Burst Cancel · Aug 09, 2008, 10:19 PM // 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeKnowMo

You'll rack up the DP pretty fast which means a HM run will come to an end.

No, that's the whole point of UA. You can't fail because you won't wipe - everyone person that dies resses someone else. Given that the res'd person comes back to life with full health/nrg, and UA is a 1/4s cast; the whole party can run around at 60DP pretty safely.

joshuarodger · Aug 09, 2008, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

No, that's the whole point of UA. You can't fail because you won't wipe - everyone person that dies resses someone else. Given that the res'd person comes back to life with full health/nrg, and UA is a 1/4s cast; the whole party can run around at 60DP pretty safely.

if you're in HM your whole team can't be running around with 60 DP. and if it's NM, well it doesn't really matter what you take, usually. you should be able to auto attack your way through most of NM. of course, one person with this skill and less than 60 DP could just hang back and not get involved if they have this skill equipped.

-Lotus- · Aug 09, 2008, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshuarodger

if you're in HM your whole team can't be running around with 60 DP.

why not? you wont get kicked unless you wipe.

Scythe O F Glory · Aug 09, 2008, 11:59 PM // 23:59

Alright i've played around with this skill as well...

Since YOU maintain it, you can res anyone from anywhere within the area, so like if your entire party dies except you and you end up running away and living, you can res your entire party at full health and energy, and they are teleported to you... REGARDLESS of where they are.

So this is easily the most powerful res in the game.

As for the healing bonus, well it is slightly better than HB, and the 50% casting time isnt that big of a deal. But it works with ALL healing spells, not just those in healing prayers. So your prot or DF or even smites can heal extra. IMO that's way better than HB and offers a ton of opportunities.

Also... if you feel like spamming heal party or a bunch of non enchantment big heals, bring Holy Haste, which makes up for the +50% speed that HB offers.

The 10 sec recharge is what makes this skill amazing. If you get it ripped while someones dead, well you just ressed someone without even knowing it. And you can recast it in a sec (actually less)

IMO, its great for PvE, i bring it on all my heroes, although they dont ALWAYS use it as a res skill, and they fail to maintain it sometimes. Just combine with holy haste and you've got yourself an UBER HB + BEST RES IN THE GAME. Only bad thing is the -1 energy to maintain but any good monk can overcome that.

Oh and to answer some questions above... you CAN be wiped but only if your the last one alive and you die with it. Not sure if someone will get ressed, but if they do either way, you die b4 they res so its a wipe and you'll go to the shrine get kicked out.

And heroes maintain it MOST of the time, you may have to manually do it sometimes. And to res someone, they usually don't do it immediately, eventually they will cancel it, but its easier if you do it yourself. Although of course heroes are retarted, and after ressing it'll take their brains some time to realize they're not maintaining it and recast it.

Burst Cancel · Aug 10, 2008, 01:44 AM // 01:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshuarodger

if you're in HM your whole team can't be running around with 60 DP. and if it's NM, well it doesn't really matter what you take, usually. you should be able to auto attack your way through most of NM. of course, one person with this skill and less than 60 DP could just hang back and not get involved if they have this skill equipped.

Huh? There's nothing in HM that prevents you from getting 60DP. You only get kicked out if you wipe with everyone at 60. If anyone is alive, you can't fail - which was my whole point about UA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scythe O F Glory

snip

There's no point comparing this skill to HB. The entire point of UA is the res; from a healing standpoint HB is strictly superior because it's not maintained.

The irony seems to be lost on many: UA gives you the most broken res in the game at the cost of reduced ability to keep people alive. Taking any res skill automatically makes it more likely that you will need to use it.

-Lotus- · Aug 10, 2008, 01:54 AM // 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

The irony seems to be lost on many: UA gives you the most broken res in the game at the cost of reduced ability to keep people alive. Taking any res skill automatically makes it more likely that you will need to use it.

hahaha, clever...

joshuarodger · Aug 10, 2008, 04:23 AM // 04:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Lotus-

why not? you wont get kicked unless you wipe.

ummm... /facepalm. i guess i just don't recall ever being booted from HM.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

There's no point comparing this skill to HB. The entire point of UA is the res; from a healing standpoint HB is strictly superior because it's not maintained.

The irony seems to be lost on many: UA gives you the most broken res in the game at the cost of reduced ability to keep people alive. Taking any res skill automatically makes it more likely that you will need to use it.

these are actually good points. but i'd still like to try it out and see the real differences.

BruskoKariskoff · Aug 10, 2008, 06:33 AM // 06:33

i've been using it a ton, in and out of guild groups. That extra skill slot that it opens up, leaves you with another space you can tailor your build for the area, be it needing hex/condition removal, party wide healing, or w/e. Makes for a great battle rez and strong healing. Throw cons into the mix, and this skill gets even more rediculous.

Grammar · Aug 10, 2008, 01:49 PM // 13:49

60dp would actually be a GOOD thing in an 8-man [unyielding aura]+[putrid explosion]+[death nova] team, because it means you would die faster, which is the entire point of the "build". More deaths means more DN triggers and more corpses for Putrid spam.

It's risk free as long as you are able to cast and maintain UA before each death, because you CANNOT WIPE, EVER! There will always be 7 living players at all times, even if each player dies 50 times in a single fight.

JoeKnowMo · Aug 10, 2008, 04:09 PM // 16:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scythe O F Glory

But it works with ALL healing spells, not just those in healing prayers. So your prot or DF or even smites can heal extra. IMO that's way better than HB and offers a ton of opportunities.

Actually, it doesn't work with all healing spells.

It works with only Divine Healing and Heaven's Delight from DF. There are no direct heals from Smiting so none of the skills in that line benefit from UA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scythe O F Glory

Also... if you feel like spamming heal party or a bunch of non enchantment big heals, bring Holy Haste, which makes up for the +50% speed that HB offers.

Heal Party necessitates GoLE. So along with Holy Haste and UA, 4 slots are already taken up on your bar.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

No, that's the whole point of UA. You can't fail because you won't wipe - everyone person that dies resses someone else. Given that the res'd person comes back to life with full health/nrg, and UA is a 1/4s cast; the whole party can run around at 60DP pretty safely.

Point taken. But the chances of a wipe in HM are high when you can be killed with one shot at 60DP. UA + DN looks to be more for grins n giggles than efficient play.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BruskoKariskoff

i've been using it a ton, in and out of guild groups.

Why are you taking a rez in a guild group?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burst Cancel

The irony seems to be lost on many: UA gives you the most broken res in the game at the cost of reduced ability to keep people alive. Taking any res skill automatically makes it more likely that you will need to use it.

Very true. I find I need some sort of e-mgmt like [sig of rejuv] and both [divine healing] and [heaven's delight] if I want to party heal. Patient, Dkiss, and Dismiss leave me with 1 slot for PS, Aegis, another heal, etc. depending on what the other monk is bringing.

But if the probability of death is high, i.e., you're in a pug, then this skill actually results in bar compression or at the very least money saved by not having to use rez scrolls.

zelgadissan · Aug 10, 2008, 04:54 PM // 16:54

I'll be the first to say I haven't tested this so feel free to just flame me. Say everybody dies at once (Meditation of the Reaper comes to mind). Will this trigger after death, or will it check and see nobody's dead, then everyone dies and wipes?

BruskoKariskoff · Aug 10, 2008, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by BruskoKariskoff
i've been using it a ton, in and out of guild groups.

JoeKnowMO
Why are you taking a rez in a guild group?

Because stuff happens and people die? or maybe i don't pretend to be an elitist and like to be prepared?

FoxBat · Aug 10, 2008, 07:12 PM // 19:12

Obviously you need a new guild. PvE is srs bsns after all.

BruskoKariskoff · Aug 10, 2008, 07:32 PM // 19:32

meh, so sue me for taking a rez in a guild group, i love the guild im in and i love this skill. I'm just a PvE noob that has been playing since beta. :P

Edit: what is srs bsns?